Barbara Alcaraz Silva - J.P. Morgan - Part 2

Intro - 00:00:01: Welcome to the Biotech Startups Podcast by Excedr Join us as we speak with first-time founders, serial entrepreneurs, and experienced investors about the challenges and triumphs of running a biotech startup from pre-seed to IPO with your host, Jon Chee. In our last episode, we spoke with Barbara Alcaraz-Silva about her journey from Mexico to the United States and how her upbringing played an important role in her path to becoming a scientist entrepreneur. We also covered her experience at UC Irvine, where she gained essential lab experience, secured a research position in plant biology, and later travelled abroad to the National Autonomous University of Mexico. If you missed it, be sure to go back and listen to part one. In part two, we continue our conversation with Barbara, hearing more about her academic journey and graduate school lab experience at UC Irvine. She shares insights from her time at the Beckman Laser Institute and recounts her groundbreaking research on DNA repair using lasers. Lastly, we chat about her international fellowship at King's College London, where she explored stem cell biology and how her transition to entrepreneurship was shaped by navigating different lab environments and overcoming funding challenges.

Jon - 00:01:31: But as you're thinking about your applying to grad school, what made you decide to ultimately go back to, I believe you're at the Beckman Laser Institute.

Barbara - 00:01:42: Yes. And that was at UC Irvine. So I love Irvine so much. I mean, I applied for a few schools. I also didn't want to move away from home that much. I mean, during college, I was living at home. You know, we couldn't, I couldn't afford to live on campus, didn't have enough financial aid. And I enjoy the time at UC Irvine. And I think that was one of the reasons, like being close to home. And I think that's also part of our family values. You know, when you're an immigrant, it's like, OK, I have to be close to mom or to your house. So then you can get free food or something. So the idea of moving away was like a no-no to me. I was like, how am i gonna survive?

Jon - 00:02:26: Yeah.

Barbara - 00:02:26: Which is so interesting because then i moved from a different country too so.

Jon - 00:02:31: That is like a that in itself is very difficult so you. 

Barbara - 00:02:37: Yeah, I was like, no, I'm definitely going to stay in Irvine. So I remember applying only to a few schools and they were like UC Riverside, UC Merced, because then I figured out that Stanford and UC Merced, they were not the same.

Jon - 00:02:50: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Barbara - 00:02:51: Very different. UC San Diego and, you know, all the UC systems, because that's the only thing that I knew in all the schools in California. So and then eventually, of course, I think I got everywhere except Stanford. But I still decided to go to Irvine because they had a great umbrella program. Oh, and I applied to UCSF too, which is very interesting. Eventually, I ended up doing my postdoc at UCSF. So yeah, so I accepted the offer, you know, went through the interview process and they love all the research that I was doing. And I accepted attending UC Irvine. And the reason is because they have an umbrella program where you can rotate in different labs in different departments. And you have seen me so far, how much I have shared that I'm being moving around in different disciplines, right? So and I think for me, it was super helpful because it's like, I love biology, but I'm not sure. So once I, you know, started. At Irvine, then, you know, I did the same thing. Every quarter. I would rotate in a different lab. My first lab was in a Drosophila lab studying Huntington's disease. I decided that I don't like to work with Drosophila.

Jon - 00:04:05: There we go.

Barbara - 00:04:06: Yes. So neuroscience was like, hmm, I don't know if I have to work with Drosophila. Then my second rotation also was doing research with mice, studying the hippocampus and all, you know, the neuronal cell regeneration. That was interesting. But the culture of the lab wasn't a fit for me somehow. And they had so many people. I remember my project. I had to go to the lab every three hours for, I mean, literally, I remember going into midnight and then at 3 a.m. To just take, you know, some metrics. And I just did not enjoy that project. And then eventually I rotated in the lab of one of the pioneers who, you know, started developing lasers to do biology with lasers. And he was at the Beckman Institute, which is interesting is that he was not a biologist. He was more like an engineer. He did study biology, but then all his career he was more focused on lasers, microsurgeries and doing all of that. So I joined his lab and he was part of the developmental and cell biology department. And that's how I ended up staying and doing my Ph.D. Work with with him. So that was another interesting journey.

Jon - 00:05:24: You mentioned kind of like hopping around and it sounded like the two first labs were like not a good fit. But that's exactly what you kind of need until you found this kind of resonance. And can you talk a little bit about being in that specific lab and whose labs was this?

Barbara - 00:05:39: I'm Michael Brintz.

Jon - 00:05:41: Awesome. Can you talk about your research in that lab?

Barbara - 00:05:44: Yeah. And he became my mentor. He passed away two years ago. So that was a little bit hard and difficult because, you know, I felt like he actually took me under his wing and supported me. I mean, he paid for my career, literally. That's a little bit of a P.I. So he paid for my career. So, yeah, so I joined his lab because there were a few things. He gave me an interesting project that nobody was working on and he had no idea how to do that. And the second thing is like he had a lot of money. He had a lot of funding. So and, you know, when you're a grad student and you you hear the gossip like, no, you need to find a lab with good funding and stay there. And also the lab culture needs to be great. Right. So when somebody told me, no, he has a lot of funding, I was like, I'm set. 

Jon - 00:06:37: Yeah, I'm set. I'm set. This is perfect. Yeah, I found it. I found it.

Barbara - 00:06:40: I'm not going to struggle. But so, yeah, I joined his lab. And yeah, I remember the first couple of meetings and probably was after a couple of weeks of me joining and getting acquainted. He's like, Barbara, I want you to study the telomere. And I want you to damage the telomere with lasers. And I'm like. How? And that was my project. Go and do it. I will go into his office and he will give me just all these. And he didn't, he never shared with me, this is how you're going to do it. Like, okay, the steps. You know, he had another grad student who was, you know, a few years in. She was the one who taught me how to use the lasers and do DNA repair. I mean, like we were studying DNA repair pretty much. Use all the protocols. But then at the same time, I had to develop my own protocols because it was so new. I mean, who is doing cutting DNA with lasers? That was like so antique. It's like, no, this is not innovative. Yeah. Maybe UV. And we had a UV laser. Yeah, yeah. And again, it took me some time. Literally, I remember it took me two years. That was the most difficult project because I was like, what is the hypothesis in here? Like, no, go figure it out. So I have to read so many papers. Of course, eventually my project ended up becoming like a DNA repair project where, you know, you damage the telomeres that delay cell division. I mean, it was all these years to really get into that point.

Jon - 00:08:08: Yeah.

Barbara - 00:08:09: The benefit of being with him and have him as a mentor is that he was so connected to many research institutions. And I guess when he felt comfortable of me, you know, being in the specific stage, he was like, I want you to connect with this faculty that I'm being supporting. And he said, Harvard. So I ended up collaborating with him. He became another mentor. And then he connected me with another faculty in the chemistry or bookend department.

Jon - 00:08:36: You're back.

Barbara - 00:08:37: Yeah, I'm back. Yeah, I'm back. I'm telling you, all of this is interconnected. And, you know, and I think because of that, his guidance and also letting me to be independent, because not that many people especially when you're in the academic setting, let you be independent. So he let me be independent. And literally, I learned. From the beginning to be very independent, manage my own mini team, because then I had undergrads that I had to manage. They work on different projects. And, you know, this is talking about the good days, right? Because then again, struggling at the beginning. But then, you know, I pick up on the literature. I attended a lot of conferences. Eventually I had enough data because you need to collect data, right? I had enough research data about my project that I was able to present it in different conferences. All by myself. I mean, I didn't have my team, but then it was great because people, really good professors and faculty, they will come and judge my poster. It's like, okay, this is an interesting result. Why are you doing this? And that's where I started gaining more knowledge. And then I published my first paper, which is in a whatever journal. But then from there, I picked it up and I think I ended up publishing six papers out of my PhD thesis. Not the most amazing, you know, high impact papers, but, you know, they were decent enough and great collaborations and all of that because of Michael. Michael, let me be free. And I remember I will come, I will go to his office and tell him, okay, this is what I'm doing, what I'm, you know, X, Y, and Z. And at that point, I remember his eyes being so open because like, Barbara, you're so ready now. You don't, I mean, just go and do. And I will be this student who will do whatever I wanted to do. And I will just need approval from him. And of course, he's, he's.

Jon - 00:10:34: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Barbara - 00:10:36: But at the same time, because, you know, I learned to manage my budget. I ended up, you know, getting different fellowships, lots of support, conference support. You know, they had grants, travel grants. So I was always mindful. And I think that also helped me a lot, too, because then I was writing grants, you know, supporting myself. Because I was like, I know I have my goal, but I also want to show that I'm capable of getting my own funding. So that's also something that I did.

Jon - 00:11:08: That's very cool. It almost seems like a very entrepreneurial PhD experience. 

Barbara - 00:11:14: Without not knowing what it was to be an entrepreneur, because that's another story.

Jon - 00:11:19: Yeah. Like, because, you know, he's like, spread your wings, do your thing.

Barbara - 00:11:24: Exactly. And it was all because of Michael. So I'm so grateful because Michael paid for my career, supported my family. I'm so grateful to him. So, yeah.

Jon - 00:11:36: That's absolutely amazing. and I guess something, a quick question you mentioned, you then were, you started to have a team that you were responsible for. I'm going to imagine that was your first time managing. How was that experience?

Barbara - 00:11:50: You know, it's interesting because when you're a PhD, you always hear about, you know, PhD candidate. You always hear about who are the best people that can do the research for you pre-meds.

Jon - 00:12:02: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Barbara - 00:12:05: I wish that was the case in life, you know, in other, I'm sure other corporates or like, yeah. And of course, I interviewed so many people. I don't even know how I, I don't think we posted it online or anything. I don't even recall how I, you know, how I ended up interviewing and recruiting students. But, you know, I had different students. And. One specifically, Jessica, who was incredible, she ended up publishing a couple of papers with me. So she learned all the protocols, the procedures. I will, you know, draft the experiments, the rationale, then a hypothesis, and we will come together to really put that project together, right? And it's interesting because Jessica will show up. 5 or 6 a.m. In the lab, again, a pre-med.

Jon - 00:12:59: Yep, yep, that tracks, that tracks, that tracks.

Barbara - 00:13:02: Super experiments because we were doing a lot of cell monitoring in the microscope, so it was a lot of microscopy. Work. And she will do those experiments and then we'll leave and take, you know, her classes. If she had time in the evening, then she will come back. Otherwise, I will pick up the work. You know, and pretty much what I did, I drafted. I drafted all the findings, and that's how we ended up publishing. And then eventually, you know, she was so good. That I spend most of my time traveling and talking about our results. So she was the only member, actually, now that I think about it, because she was so efficient, so thoughtful. Very dedicated. And I think she... Recently, she graduated from residency. So it's been a joy, though. But, you know, you learn eventually how to manage people, right? Depending on the need of the project or the culture, the environment. What is also their goals? Because she was like very focused. I was like, I want to get into grad school. So it's like, perfect. You know, I know that one of the requirements is for you to do research. Let's do the best. So then your name can be in one of our publications. And she ended up having two publications, which were super helpful in her resume. So the same, you know, you focus on their skill sets, whether if it's a fit, you know, where do they want to go? Because, you know, besides her, I also gave my time back to mentor other students, especially the students from the minority science program. Because, you know, at the time, now I was a grad student. I was no longer an undergrad. So yeah, so giving a lot of guidance and, you know, figuring out where they wanted to go. Because if somebody said, by the way, I have no interest in going into grad school. So then, well, I don't think being in a research publication will help you, right?

Jon - 00:14:57: Yep.

Barbara - 00:14:57: So you need to define that and figure that out as well.

Jon - 00:15:02: It really sounds like, you know, these are like, you know, I think about even how we think about like. Professional development at Exceder or just like startups and just company building and stuff like that. That is exactly what you were going through in grad school. It's like figuring out like, what is their motivation? What is their why? And how do we appeal to their why? And then you give them room to run. It sounds like that freed you up to do what was, you know, I'm going to imagine going out, communicating, talking about the science. It's something that, you know, is something that you can tap in and you can do that's uniquely your strength and giving them the opportunity to kind of do what they're good at. So that's very, very cool to hear. And as you're wrapping up your time at, you know, for your Ph.D. Program, I know you also had a fellowship at King's College London. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Barbara - 00:15:56: Yeah. So, and again, me trying to learn something different because I love my PhD work and thesis, you know, I was so focused on telomeres and DNA repair. And at the time there was the group. Globally, I mean, like literally if you see the scientists now, I think it's a little bit bigger than that, especially with CRISPR, right? But at the time, the group of DNA repair was just, it was a very small group that you can tell who were the top scientists or the top institutions, right? But I always had a curiosity for stem cell biology. And I remember at the time, you know, I was having a discussion with one of the directors of the MSP program, the minority science program, where they had this fellowship and research abroad in London. And I was like, and at the time it was a good time for me to try that and do that. And to be honest, and I felt like I needed to get away from the US. It was just, you know, I was very hands down, very focused on, doing all this studying and research and, and I just needed to explore more. So I apply, of course, I, this time, I actually, I was the one who chose the lab. And me, again, being ignorant and not knowing. So I went into their website and I said, I want to work with Fiona Watts. And Fiona Watts, she is one of the pioneers of stem cell biology. Again, I mean, I was like, okay, well, what are the chances of me getting into a lab? She, you know, had a lab in Cambridge and then moved to London to open the stem cell center at King's College. And it actually was in the hospital called Guy's, the Guy's Hospital, the top of the tower. That's where she, you know, initially started. Expanding and, you know, putting together her lab in London. So, of course, you know, I got the yes and approval, got my travel fellowship and all of that. So I joined the lab and it was incredible because then you had international students. The time in London, it was incredible because it's like here in the U.S. I felt like I was like any other Mexican. If you didn't know who I was or what I did or whether if I had a PhD, in London, it was like, oh, you're a scientist. Great. That's the priority, right? And the second thing they will say is like, oh, you have an American accent. And I'm like.

Jon - 00:18:30: I didn't know that. That's really cool like one thing that like you know just really stood out to me is like and i after having conversations with other leaders like yourself it seems that they're like i'm doing a little pattern matching here but just like there are these like very monumental emails or just like messages like cold outreach that open up an crazy amount of opportunity you're like you We'll see what happens. Sending it. And you end up finding yourself in the UK.

Barbara - 00:19:03: Exactly. And that was a great experience. I loved it. I loved the project. It was, you know, it was interesting for me to get acquainted with, you know, some systems and even the sector, because, of course, that wasn't my expertise. My project was, you know, very simple, to be honest. One of the things that I learned immediately is like, because I was thinking at the time where I wanted to go. I knew that I wanted to do a postdoc, but I wasn't sure. And I think being in England and London gave me tremendous experience. I learned pretty quickly that that's an interesting country where, you know, people have fun, you know, like a lot. And I was, you know, cut up for that. So I didn't have family there. But I think science is incredible. There's a lot of opportunity. And the fact that I felt super welcome, it was great. And then eventually, you know, I started looking for a postdoc position. So I finished my time there. And actually, no, before I finished my time, because I was looking for a postdoc position, I remember reaching out to different faculty, different institutions. And again, I went back to Stanford. I'm like, I'm not going give up. 

Jon - 00:20:19: Second, third time's the charm. I'm going to make this happen.

Barbara - 00:20:23: And I found this faculty who was also doing DNA repair, but she was looking at the chromatin modifications of the DNA. You know, like when your DNA gets super packed and then when it won't pack the DNA. So I thought that was interesting. Reach out, you know, because at the time, you know, you usually reach out with your attachment resume. You explain why you will be great or why you have interest in the lab. And then also I sent my resume to a faculty at UCSF. And both of them replied. The faculty, because I put my phone number, the professor at UCSF actually called me directly into my phone.

Jon - 00:21:03: Oh, wow.

Barbara - 00:21:04: Because I never pick up.

Jon - 00:21:06: Yeah, yeah. Well, I don't recognize this.

Barbara - 00:21:08: This is 415.

Jon - 00:21:10: Yeah, yeah.

Barbara - 00:21:11: And I was in London, literally. It's like, who?

Jon - 00:21:14: This is going to be really expensive. Like, I don't know if I'm going to pick this up.

Barbara - 00:21:17: Yeah. And so he called me, left a message and then sent me an

Jon - 00:21:23: email. Oh, wow.

Barbara - 00:21:25: He was literally working, you know, on DNA repair in the telomeres. He read some of my papers. He was interested to get a hold of me because he was using a different system. Remember that I use lasers to damage the DNA? And so he was using endonucleases to cut the DNA. And he's like, I think, you know, we'll love for you to come and see the lab or find a way to collaborate. If you're still interested or if you're still in that lab. He thought that I still was in Irvine. But literally, he knew that I was in London. And I was like, and I got so excited because, first of all, he left me a voicemail and then sent me a note, which was great.

Jon - 00:22:06: That's amazing.

Barbara - 00:22:08: Yeah. And the faculty at Stanford, equally great, sent also a note. I think it was like weeks later or so. Then when I went back to California, of course, I did my tours and you had to present your project and gave an entire seminar. Right. And I felt like at Stanford, I was like pitching myself too much. You know, I was like, this is who I am and this is why I'm so great. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Versus at UCSF, it was the opposite. And I don't think I gave a presentation, actually, which is very interesting. I have.

Jon - 00:22:45: Well, I mean, you kind of did a presentation already with your papers that you already published. Your professor was already like, no, no, no, no. Well, I've read all your papers already. This is like, I kind of, I got a feeling.

Barbara - 00:22:56: And again, and, you know, his name is John Mornain. He retired a few years back. He was a emeritus faculty. He became a emeritus faculty and he collaborated with Liz Blackburn. So it was, it was a great experience. Yeah, I ended up going into his lab. The lab environment was incredible. All the colleagues, the other, you know, he only had postdocs. And he was so dedicated because he will be the professor and the faculty that will be doing experiments, which is very interesting. He will do experiments and he will teach me everything himself, which he was. It was because I didn't have that during my Ph.D. My my P.I. Literally told me, OK, go and figure it out. And on the other hand, here I find myself older, a little bit more experienced, I guess. An older professor who is still

Jon - 00:23:53: In the lab yeah

Barbara - 00:23:54: So it was it was incredible um experience and i loved it and um you know i didn't spend too much time because we ran out of funding

Jon - 00:24:08: That's the dichotomy, right? I think, you know, you were on either end of the spectrum. You're in like super well-funded.

Barbara - 00:24:15: Oh, yeah. And then I, Exactly. And then I also brought my own grant when, you know, but it's not only that, right? It's like, how do we support the lab? And so we had to shut down, literally, which is very sad. But, but yeah, it was an incredible experience. And at the same time, because I was back in San Francisco, my first time living in the city, where I realized like, wow, this is super expensive.

Jon - 00:24:45: Yeah.

Barbara - 00:24:48: And being a postdoc, it was incredible. It was like, it was a great experience, but also it was very hard. You know, and then from there, it took me to different, to do different things and become an entrepreneur because I needed to become an entrepreneur.

Jon - 00:25:02: Yeah. I mean, sometimes necessity is like what it takes and something that stood out to me about, you're talking about like lab cultures and like, it's incredibly important to find that culture that fits. And you're talking about as you're doing rotations at UC Irvine. Listen to your gut you're like these ones not a cultural fit for me and i feel like if you fight that gut kind of like listening to your gut you're in for a world of pain at least for me i'm speaking personally now but anytime i have like the gut feeling that this is not it, every time I override that with my mind, it ends up being the wrong decision. You're just like, should have listened to the gut there. And it's like, because your gut, it might be a more qualitative or subconscious element to this. And I like that you went with like, this feels right, the culture's right. And it doesn't always pan out like, right? Not every lab is gonna be super well-funded. It just happens to be that way. So that totally is the kind of how it unfolds. And so you're now at UCSF. Okay, okay.

Outro - 00:26:08: That's all for this episode of the Biotech Startups Podcast. We hope you enjoyed our discussion with Barbara Alcaraz-Silva. Tune in for part three of our conversation to learn more about her journey. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, leave us a review and share it with your friends. Thanks for listening. And we look forward to having you join us again on the Biotech Startups Podcast for part three of Barbara's story. The Biotech Startups Podcast is produced by Excedr Don't want to miss an episode? Search for the Biotech Startups Podcast wherever you get your podcasts and click subscribe. Excedr provides research labs with equipment leases on founder-friendly terms to support paths to exceptional outcomes. To learn more, visit our website, www.excedr.com. On behalf of the team here at Excedr thanks for listening. The Biotech Startups podcast provides general insights into the life science sector through the experiences of its guests. The use of information on this podcast or materials linked from the podcast is at the user's own risk. The views expressed by the participants are their own and are not the views of Excedr or sponsors. No reference to any product, service or company in the podcast is an endorsement by Excedr or its guests.